politicette: (BOSTACHE)
[personal profile] politicette
A lot of people are getting up in arms about Stephen's transgender beef joke from 4/2/12, and I've got to be honest, I think the outrage is a little  out of place.

My reasoning for this goes a deeper than just "I'm trans and I wasn't offended," though of course I am, and I wasn't, but that's because I don't think that trans people are the butt of the joke. In my opinion, the premise of the joke does not rely on the idea that transgender people, by virtue of their identity, are inherently ridiculous, but on the idea that ascribing human qualities to beef is a very silly thing to do that should make people laugh.

I know that some people have interpreted the structure and punchline of the joke to be "This beef is riddled with hormones + trans people take hormones = trans people are ridiculous," but my reading was "This beef is full of hormones +trans people take hormones + LFTB sounds like LGBT = transgender beef = joke-worthy notion," and honestly, I think my reading is has much more factual support.

Obviously there's not a lot to go on, as it was a very brief joke, but I think that Stephen's "apology" in which he addresses members of the "bovine transgender community," supports my reading.

The notion of a bovine transgender community is quite obviously ludicrous, but that's not dependent on a bigoted perspective of trans people that views us as inherently ridiculous or grotesque or any of the other negative perceptions that would make the joke transphobic. Again, the joke relies not on the idea that transgender people are inherently worthy of mockery by virtue of their transness, but on the idea that ascribing human qualities, such as gender, to cows, is silly.

I mean, I guess you can make the argument that the joke works like "trans people are unnatural + cows are animals and therefore natural = the disconnect when ascribing an unnatural quality to a natural animal is hilarious," but that feels like an unbelievable stretch to me.

TL;DR: get out of there, cow. you do not have a gender identity you are a cow.

THAT BEING SAID. I do recognize that it's unusual to hear a joke involving trans people, made by a cis person, that is not transphobic. Actually, my own initial reaction was one of discomfort. But upon further reflection, I think that was more of a Pavlovian response to hearing the trans community brought up in a humorous context than anything to do with the joke itself.

But what do you all think?
erinptah: (fountain)
[personal profile] erinptah
Daily Show writer Jo Miller talks to Darbi Worley and TDS co-creator Lizz Winnstead talk about being a "comedy writer and known possessor of a vagina."

This came out shortly after the infamous Jezebel article, and I'm surprised it didn't make the rounds at the time. It goes into more detail about the inner workings of TDS, in general and as they relate to gender and sexism, than pretty much anything else I've seen since. And it's certainly the longest discussion from people whose opinions are based on their own experiences.
erinptah: (starscape)
[personal profile] erinptah
I just crunched a ton of numbers for a discussion over at [community profile] writingthewall, an RPF meta comm. In the name of not wasting effort, I'm copying them here. No argument to go with, just hard data.

This is a list of all the pairing and character tags that have appeared on the newskink delicious more than once as of 2011/06/26, followed by breakdowns based on race and gender. Totals are calculated based on the original genders (and, in the case of Yonatan, race) of the people involved, whether or not that was altered within the fic.

Numbers! )
erinptah: (Birds)
[personal profile] erinptah
This post is a reaction to the "TDS/the Rally portray liberals and conservatives as equally out-of-control" criticism. The fact that it's about half a year behind the times is a demonstration of my epic procrastinating skills.

See, here's the thing. When I first heard the false-equivalency argument, my reaction was "But TDS goes after conservative extremism so much more than liberal extremism! Surely it can recognize that the left has fewer problems without refusing to criticize them at all." Then I started to wonder if that was objectively true, or if I was just overcompensating for my own liberalism. Finally, I decided to crunch some actual numbers.

These...are those numbers.

First, a selection of clips. To get a consistent measurement, I went to the website and looked up all Daily Show episode clips, from the year 2010, that were tagged with the names of Maddow, Olbermann, Beck, and O'Reilly. Excludes web-exclusive montages (because they compile footage already covered in the episodes) and Moments of Zen (because they don't come with context, and they're all Glenn Beck anyway).

Big list o'clips )

Now for the Rally itself. First some raw data, then a few percentages.

Chuck...? )

IN CONCLUSION: Calling out prominent right-wing pundits is a regular feature on-air, while the same has only happened a handful of times with their left-wing "equivalents." In addition, the quality of the callouts differs. Liberal callouts sometimes end with both parties coming to an agreement over whether the criticism was valid, while conservative callouts are more flatly dismissive, and never get reconciled. When compared to this baseline, the Rally put a surprising amount of focus on liberals; but in its massive montages of media criticism, conservatives still featured nearly twice as much.

Or, to summarize: TDS goes after conservative extremism so much more than liberal extremism.
jesidres: allow me to explain through interpretive Dance (Default)
[personal profile] jesidres
So, the rally's over- what are people's thoughts?

I have to say, after all is said and done... I'm disappointed. Whatever message there was supposed to be, the point seemed to be, quite frankly, "both sides are bad, everybody is blowing everything out of proportion, so be more apathetic". Calling out Rush Limbaugh a racist for singing "Barack the Magic Negro" is as bad as calling President Obama socialist marxist. And I can't say I agree with that.

There were good points to the Rally, but... with that end push of false equivalency and "both sides are bad", I got left with a bitter taste in my mouth. Yes, lets tone down the rhetoric, lets try and work together, but... don't tell me I have to "sit down and shut up" when someone is bigoted or racist.

Now I know there are some who would argue that's not what Jon or Stephen were going for, but I then have to ask- if that was the case, do you really think both sides are equally bad, as they were portrayed?

EDIT: Here's a transcript of Jon's ending speech. It doesn't contain the 'debate', however: http://www.examiner.com/celebrity-in-national/rally-to-restore-sanity-jon-stewart-s-closing-speech-full-text

"The worst sin toward our fellow creatures is not to hate them, but to be indifferent to them: that's the essence of inhumanity." -George Bernard Shaw
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[personal profile] espreite

Hello, TDS and TCR are back from their vacation, so let's have up a new discussion post, try and get some talk going. Got any thoughts? Share them!
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[personal profile] espreite

Here you go, folks. Discuss away, whatever you'd like to talk about.
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[personal profile] espreite
Discussion thread banner

Sorry about not posting a discussion thread last week (was experiencing college exams for the first time). Seeing as yesterday was Independence Day in America, why not talk about how TDS/TCR deal with issues of nationalism and reporting on other countries? Or, you know, anything else that you feel like discussing!
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[personal profile] espreite
Discussion thread

Hello again! If you haven't already seen, some interesting articles have been posted in the Prompt/Resource post, like A Thin Line Between Stereotype and Satire from Racialicious on Olivia Munn's first appearance and a behind the scenes article on TDS's editing process (thanks, [personal profile] chatananasand [personal profile] seagullsong!) Any thoughts on them?

And of course, talk about what's going on in the shows, or anything else you find relevant :)
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[personal profile] espreite
Welcome to the first

Discussion thread

What are your favorite and least favorite moments on the shows that deal with serious issues so far? Share them with us and see if anybody else had thoughts about them!

Feel free to bring up any other discussion topics in the comments, or to make your own post :)

(In the future, these will be posted on Mondays. Also, anyone want to make a pretty banner like the OT ones at FNFF and fknwsgenderswap? Thank you, [personal profile] sarken!)
espreite: (Default)
[personal profile] espreite
This is the place to stick anything you happen to find that could be relevant to this comm. Got a favorite clip of Daily Show pwnage? Got a clip where somebody failed really, *really* badly? Read an article about fakenews and hipster racism? Sick of me writing in questions yet? Well, please post them here! This way, I'll have things to prompt a weekly discussion thread and everybody has a nice resource post for TDS/TCR srs bsns materials

Link Collection
Stephen Colbert's 7 Best Ching Chong Ding Dong Moments at Comedy Central
Cartoon about Asian stereotypes on the Colbert Report at Secret Asian Man (bottom of the page)
Behind the scenes look at TDS's field piece editing at Friendly Atheist
A Thin Line Between Stereotype and Satire: The Daily Show's Asian Correspondent Olivia Munn at Racialicious
The Daily Show's Woman Problem at Jezebel
Women of The Daily Show speak at The Daily Show
espreite: (Default)
[personal profile] espreite
Hello! This is the new, shiny-smelling community for discussing srs bsns issues in fakenews fandom. However, aside from it existing with a vague sense of purpose, there's not really a clear idea of what's going on here.

So that is where you (the People) come in. What would everyone like to get out of this community? What sort of rules would we like (I have made some up for the profile, but they are very tentative)? Would anyone like to suggest a layout, or even better, make a pretty header? Anyone want to mod with me? Other thoughts?

One possibility to kick off discussion is to have weekly posts to talk about the week's shows. The logical day for that is Friday, but I'm aware that some people have social lives that might not work best for this, so if anyone has suggestions, share them!

And lastly, advertise this place to anyone who might be interested so we can get a community going!
espreite: (Default)
[personal profile] espreite
Have any sort of question for the mod(s)? This is the spot.

Anything in the way of comments, questions, suggestions on content or layout can go here. If it doesn't have any other place but you have something to say, stick it here or PM me. :D